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Flysurfer Soul 10m

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Created by drsurf 6 months ago, 19 Nov 2018
drsurf
NSW, 37 posts
19 Nov 2018 2:05AM
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Disclosure: I sell Flysurfer, Moses, Naish & Konrad products.
After giving the 6m Soul a good workout with the usual 12 knots plus wind here, last Saturday had a a forecast with red arrows all day, less than 10 knots and South Easterly which is usually gutless and no good for wind sports.
I rigged up the 10m Soul, gave it a partial inflate and with a few tugs on the front lines it rose up slowly and fully inflated in about 30 seconds. The wind was very light with little static pull on the bar, but the kite sat easily in the sky with no tendency to overfly or back down.

I had a Moses 590 foil, 91cm mast on a Konrad Versa board which I figured would be a good match for the kite, wind strength and my 65kg weight. The wind was nearly dead onshore with a small shorebreak, but it wasn't hard dragging out as the kite pulled lightly but steadily until I reached deeper water beyond the break. A couple of dives of the kite to get the feel of it and I was up on the board and then onto the foil. I later checked Seabreeze windspeed readings for the day at the nearby measuring point and it averaged 8 knots.

Although the kite didn't feel particularly powerful in such light wind it still got me up and going with ease even without a downloop. Downlooping helped when gybing especially as my foil gybes are a bit crap. I was on the water for over an hour and even in the light patches never lacked the power from the kite to keep foiling. The small SE swell made the tack slightly angled to the shore a lot of fun as the hydrofoil accelerated and the kite just drifted along with minimal pull. The water was relatively smooth compared to the usual bay windchop making for fewer crashes and decent speed when I headed off the wind and felt the Soul take advantage of the apparent wind. Upwind angles were excellent as well considering the wind speed. I didn't get a chance to relaunch the kite as I didn't drop it. I've no reason to believe it wouldn't be just as easy as the 6m Soul but I didn't want to drop it deliberately and tempt fate to shut the wind off completely and give me a soggy swim to shore. When I reached shore I pulled the rear lines to back the kite down by myself, as there was no-one else on the beach, and then just walked along the rear lines until I reached the kite and sanded the tip. Easy enough in light wind but I'd be cautious with this method in stronger wind.

So no surprises really. A good foil kite and foil board extends your time on the water even when the wind is pissweak. Even though there are a few other foilboarders usually at my local beach, I was the only one there and had the beach to myself. They all have inflatable kites however. No doubt with a larger Moses 633 or Nash Large Surf foil I could go a couple of knots lower in wind speed and still have fun. If you can keep your kite in the air you can foil. Being lightweight helps a bit too
Contact me if you'd like to demo any of the gear mentioned above. I'll try and remember to get some pics in future.

Have fun, Dave (Dr Surf)

dafish
NSW, 1346 posts
19 Nov 2018 6:32AM
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Although your kite looks and flies amazing, there were other factors why there was no one there. I have been able to get out in less wind on my 10 Reo and Spitfire xlw wings and I weigh 82 kilos. I am down there by myself a lot. Now that you are getting into foiling you will find more solo sessions as well. Technique plays a huge part in extending your time on the water, the kite is but one equation. I was busy that day doing other things.

drsurf
NSW, 37 posts
5 Apr 2019 12:21AM
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Had the beach to myself early this week. Weak nor-easter measured at 6-8knots on the beach with my wind meter, put up the 10m Soul with Moses 633 foil and had a couple of excellent sessions. Measured the wind when I came in and it was the same 6-8knots.
For my 65kg I had plenty of power to stay up on the foil. Being a seabreeze, although it was light, it was very consistent. With no holes I wasn't coming off the foil or dropping the kite. The amount of extra time you can get on the water with a foil kite and surf hydrofoil and be having a good session, really eats into the time you should be doing other things

Setting up the Soul has been sped up by pre-inflating the kite by orienting the deflation vents into the wind and propping them open with a couple of sticks off the beach. By the time the lines have been unwound the kite is 80% inflated so just close the vents and launch

Tried out the new Flysurfer Peak4 single skin 3m kite as well on the beach. With 6-8 knots I wasn't going to get foiling with such a small kite but its performance was none the less impressive. the kite itself weighs under 600grams and would launch in virtually no wind if you walked backwards. Still in 6-8knots it was fast & powerful for a 3m kite. Keen to try it in 15 knots plus on the 633 and also to use it with my SUP foil. Considering one doesn't have to get pulled up on the board with the kite on a SUP as you're already standing, it will be interesting to see if I can get up on the foil in light winds even just working the kite. Have a Naish Thrust XL if required. Also keen to try the Peak4 downwind foiling as once you're foiling you can depower the kite to virtually nothing and just surf the windchop/swells. Even depowered and running directly at the Peak4 it doesn't collapse nor do you lose steering, it just drifts like nothing I've seen. Being so light it just hangs in the air waiting 'til you need it.

Having fun, Dave

johndg
WA, 94 posts
8 Apr 2019 3:18PM
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Hi Dave,
I was at the beach in Freo yesterday with 15 knots of wind. I was using 10m Neo on tt with some big holes in the wind. There was a person foiling on Peak4 4m kite. he said it goes better than LEI kites foiling in 15 knots also that it was super stable and able to fly in very little wind. I don't foil on a kite but just a beginner at sup foiling and was wondering how it would go with larger foil in low winds? If you try out I would be interested to hear from you.

Also I see that Flysurfer has the Viron3 that is water relaunchable. Have you had any experience with this? What is the difference between the 2?

John

freotilo
WA, 16 posts
8 Apr 2019 7:29PM
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the viron is a teaching only kite for schools and kids , from what we read about the peak the new generation seems nicer to fly , I used the peak 3 in my school and it has amazing power and low end but the flapping was annoying and seems to be a resolved issue with the 4

drsurf
NSW, 37 posts
9 Apr 2019 2:27AM
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johndg said..
Hi Dave,
I was at the beach in Freo yesterday with 15 knots of wind. I was using 10m Neo on tt with some big holes in the wind. There was a person foiling on Peak4 4m kite. he said it goes better than LEI kites foiling in 15 knots also that it was super stable and able to fly in very little wind. I don't foil on a kite but just a beginner at sup foiling and was wondering how it would go with larger foil in low winds? If you try out I would be interested to hear from you.

Also I see that Flysurfer has the Viron3 that is water relaunchable. Have you had any experience with this? What is the difference between the 2?

John



Hi John.
I hear what you're saying and I've just got in a 3m Peak4 to try out for SUP foiling as well as kitefoiling. Haven't had enough wind since it arrived to try it on my kitefoil and haven't got around to trying it on my SUP foil yet, but that's coming up next as soon as conditions allow.
However I have flown it on the beach and it certainly is an amazing kite. You only need 2-3knots of wind and it's flying easily. The 3m Peak4 I have weighs less than 600grams! So that's part of the reason it flys in so little wind. However the next great thing about the Peak4 is the drift... so much drift. If you have 6-8 knots of wind you can run hard at the kite and it just drifts back. No collapsing, no falling from the sky, you can still turn and control the kite even with minimal line tension.

When you flog the kite around the sky looping & figure eights with the bar pulled in, it's really powerful for its size, but when you sheet out you can cut the power to virtually nothing, it just goes into drift mode.

I figure that being on a SUP I don't need the kite to drag me up onto the board as I'm already standing. So I'm just using the kite as a lazy mans paddle to get me up on the foil for downwinders or small surf. Then just drift the kite when I don't need it.

As far water relaunching, its original design premise was for land & snow. However if you take a look at this thread on the Peak4 kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=197&t=2401224 you'll see a lot of early users have been kitefoiling and waterstarting the Peak4 kites quite easily. So I agree with freotilo, forget the Viron, as it's not a patch on the Peak4. You actually have to steer the Peak4 into the water deliberately, unless the wind completely disappears, to get it wet. Even in a worst case scenario and you couldn't get the kite back out of the water, just wind it up, jam it down the back of your harness and paddle back to shore. Being single skin it won't turn into a heavy bag of water and it's really compact when packed up.

As you can see I'm excited about the Peak4 potential, and I'm not the only one judging by other users and the person you met on the beach. I've been selling a few and the feedback has been very good. They are a big improvement on the Peak3. Let me know if I can help you further and I'll certainly post my Peak4 experiences.

Looking forward to more fun, but already missing summer, Dave

johndg
WA, 94 posts
10 Apr 2019 1:01PM
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Thanks for your quick reply Dave.

The person I met on the beach was certainly very happy with the kite and from the looks was comfortable using it. He also downwind wakeboarded it when I was packing up. He told me it was a much better kite than the previous model

Good to know this is a better kite than the Viron. I was curious about the differences and think that I may only have looked at the info on the Peak3 which may not have included water as a recommended use.

Very interested in your SUP foil experiences with it and will consider for next year. What are the AUD prices?

John

BrisKites
QLD, 1237 posts
12 Apr 2019 8:01PM
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johndg said..

Good to know this is a better kite than the Viron. I was curious about the differences and think that I may only have looked at the info on the Peak3 which may not have included water as a recommended use.



In no way is the Peak a better kite than the Viron, they are just VERY different. The Peak is quite powerful for it's size where the Viron offers massive de-power for each size. Both kites are slower than you would expect and neither offer outstanding upwind performance.

For ultimate low end power the Peak is the pick but remember there is no guarantee of water re-launch. If you were looking for an amazing kite in knarly conditions the Viron is one of the most forgiving kites you will ever fly.

Bossstyle
109 posts
Friday , 14 Jun 2019 10:31PM
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Can some one tell me when the soul is in the air should should the trailing edge be dead smooth. I have a new soul 10m. For it for the first time today and every time I tried to loop it it just wanted to nose bomb into the water. The right hand side trailing edge when in the air had some very small ruffles in it where as the left side appeared smooth. Could this be something to do with it and is there a way to straighten them out with out having to pull the bridle to pieces?
Could it be just that it need to be flown and worn in more?

drsurf
NSW, 37 posts
Sunday , 16 Jun 2019 1:10AM
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Bossstyle said..
Can some one tell me when the soul is in the air should should the trailing edge be dead smooth. I have a new soul 10m. For it for the first time today and every time I tried to loop it it just wanted to nose bomb into the water. The right hand side trailing edge when in the air had some very small ruffles in it where as the left side appeared smooth. Could this be something to do with it and is there a way to straighten them out with out having to pull the bridle to pieces?
Could it be just that it need to be flown and worn in more?


Hi Bossstyle.

Is the Soul brand new or used? What size bar and line length are you using? Are the lines all equal length? What wind strength and quality were you flying in? Did you check that there were absolutely no tangles/crossed lines in the bridle? Also check that there were no twigs or other debris that could have been caught in the bridle. Have you had much experience with foil kites? Did looping the kite in either direction cause the same outcome? Were you on a board of some type or just flying the Soul standing on the beach or body dragging?

As you can see there are a lot of questions. Foil kites are very different to LEI kites if you are not used to them. If the Soul is brand new it will take about 5 hours of solid use before the lines and bridle settle into their working positions. Looping a foil kite is not the same as an LEI. It may have a much larger radius loop depending on how much you pulled the bar, line length, depower settings etc. Looping the Soul may also create a very strong pull, depending on the wind, pulling you strongly towards the kite which may increase the turning radius.
Without being able to see what you were doing, it's hard to see whether this is a kite problem or an operator issue.

If you can provide some more detail on the questions above we can help you more.

Have fun, Dave

Bossstyle
109 posts
Sunday , 16 Jun 2019 7:38AM
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The kite is brand new Dave was my first time out on it out of the bag.
Exoerience wise I bought a 15m soul. Found it too big for where I kite too slow. Sold it and bought a 12m. Flew that for few weeks and really liked it.
Sold it though and bought the 10m. No where to demo kites here which is annoying so had to buy and sell at a loss each time just to experience the differences. Was hoping the ten would turn faster and it does a little but I found iCloud back loop the 12m easy for handplant transitions and darkslides slow back loop was such fun on the 12m. Tried it in the 10m and it just wouldn't do the slow back loop into you had already come out of the hand loop then pull hard and found I rolled actually under the water. So I have some experience with the souls. Just expected it toact the same but faster on the 10m. Just didn't feel like the same type kite?
Hopefully it will where in then.
I am flying it on 20m lines at the mo On a 55cm ozone bar. What is the preferred length bar for the 1. I know flysurfer recommend the 50cm for it but what do you advise on bar size and line lengths as being best for the 10m size?
was out on the water flying it. Wasn't great wind 12-13 knots.

drsurf
NSW, 37 posts
Sunday , 17 Jun 2019 12:22AM
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Hi Bossstyle.
Your bar and line sizes should be ok assuming the line lengths are equal. Have you had it out only this one time? Check bridle thoroughly as once I had a line catch on another line in the bridle which made the kite fly poorly. A friend of mine had a similar line snag with an Ozone Hyperlink. It does help to have reasonably steady wind to check the flying characteristics. 12-13 knots should be strong enough.
Have you tried the depower settings at the bar through its full range to see if that improves the turning?

Flysurfer has very good warranty on their kites but it would be good to check absolutely everything first before contacting them or your local reseller. Where are you located? Do you have any other foil kite flyers nearby who can check out your kite?

Have fun, Dave

Bossstyle
109 posts
Monday , 17 Jun 2019 7:34AM
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Yeah the distributor said they would sort it if it were faulty. I'm not convinced it is yet but will get to fly it again on the morning. Forecast -5-20 knots so will have a good play with it again. Will give all the lines and all the bridles a good tug to make sure they are all straight and free and see how o get on. I haven't let the depower our all the way yet as was low wind last time and find if I depower it I lose pull. Will try though tomorrow. Just seemed a little strange. Although The 12m soul was very powerful downlooping downwind with lots of pull if you don't pull the bar real hard to loo it. It was absolutely awesome for doing dark slides and slow back loop tricks and actually had less power in the back loop than the front (probably not if mega looping whilst air born) I thought I would immediately get that same feeling from the ten but didn't it didn't seem to loop properly and also the down loop just seemed to want to hit the water instead of going around. Will see how I get on tomorrow. It will get another couple hours wearing in then as well to hopefully settle the lines.

SaveTheWhales
WA, 1646 posts
Monday , 17 Jun 2019 7:56AM
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Go over the whole bridal ABCZ and check the line connections are even - where they attach to the kite as in the pic, quite small but its worth setting these right from day one. Any Brand new kite this should be checked - dont believe the factory hype..
Your mixer is the next check point - its very easy the way they have set it up.

Have you adjusted the any back stall out of the kite ? in very light winds - its will kill a foil instantly. The 12 & 15 are very large so you can get away with a bit here n there - the 10m and lower, you cant.

Those ruffles are normal - its part of the drag that turns or stalls the kite, when your flying straight with correct trim, it will be straight again.
Are you trying to find power like the bigger kites, grabbing a handful ?
Remember when you let the bar out slightly - it flys faster and pulls harder,.. if so, strangulation is your problem.


SaveTheWhales
WA, 1646 posts
Monday , 17 Jun 2019 8:14AM
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Bossstyle said..
I haven't let the depower our all the way yet as was low wind last time and find if I depower it I lose pull.

it didn't seem to loop properly and also the down loop just seemed to want to hit the water instead of going around. Will see how I get on tomorrow.



Dude its your bar trim - find someone who knows how to set your bar for a foil kite.. problem solved.

The 10 is a very different kite - no where near the same power and lift as the 12. The 12 is what Flysurfer do most of their Old school airstyle and darkslide tricks on...

Bossstyle
109 posts
Today , 18 Jun 2019 7:45AM
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It's old school stuff I wanted it for. I thought the boost and hang would be more on the 10m as it would be a little faster, it isn't that much faster and still has a slow turn, I thought loops would be easier too but actually at the mo finding them slow as well and to slow and powerful to use. God knows how they do these wicked helix loops and stuff in the videos. Am hoping as I gain more experience on the kite the loop will become more usable for something at least. Beginning to think i may have made a mistake selling the 12m and getting the 10 to try. I did try and get a demo of a 10m try one out before doing what o did to see which was best. But the distributor had too much going on to let them out at the mo. :-(

re trimming the bar for a foil kite.
Whats how do you mean? I tried a set of race pigtails on the ends of the lines and different knots. The kite becomes twitchy and difficult to use if you play with the line lengths I noticed. I'm using and ozone bar and when you tighten the rear lines up to the third not shortest line setting it made the 12m not handle gusts very well and become a bit of a handful.
Min the end I took them off so all four lines were the same length and the kite was a different beast, very manageable and easy to fly. Is that what you mean by trimming out the back stall? Overtightening the rear lines? I don't know any one else that flies foils at my area. All the other guys and my mates fly lei's And are interested but I can see the benefits and do think foils are the future. Not convinced they are 100 percent there yet but the soil shows it's getting there and picking up pace. No one to trim anything for me though.

Macster
VIC, 246 posts
1 hour ago , 18 Jun 2019 7:20PM
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What size bar and length lines are you using on the 10m?

SaveTheWhales
WA, 1646 posts
1 hour ago , 18 Jun 2019 5:48PM
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Understandably a pain in the butt and Very expensive, not being able to demo - I was lucky enough to demo the 12,10 & 8m.

Get yourself a 60cm bar - it will help a little with the turn speed. I use one on the 8m. Their Foil kites, not inflatables so they turn slower and anything that helps speed them up is a good thing, unless your a grandad armchair kiter..
Whatever bar you get, try to get one that does NOT jam the depower line - when turning hard. Some PU lines do this as the centre hole is not big enough, the result is that you lose some smooth steering ability. Some Pro foil kite racers hate them.

In the mean time, basic bar trimming will fix your problem. You need about 18 knots at least !!!
How I do it - because it doesn't behave like a real race foil.

Stand on the beach with the kite at 12 overhead.
Pull the depower (or) let it out, with bar full down - to see how far behind you, it will fly.

Let the Depower out until you get it to "slowly" backstall to about 1130-12 at bar full down.
It wont choke out the kite completely - it makes it stay in the power zone rather than the edge.

Now before you throw yourself in the drink - forget your board, walk out to some waist deep water in a safe spot.
Practise LOOPING your kite
1. In both directions
2. At different heights around the window
3. Count your timing

Until you are fully competent at your FOIL kite turn speed and looping control.
Grab your board - play with your timing..
Rip it Up
Pics or it didnt happen

The Heli loops will happen in no time when you get the above saughted

Bossstyle
109 posts
2 minutes ago , 18 Jun 2019 7:09PM
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Macster said..
What size bar and length lines are you using on the 10m?



55cm ozone 20m lines currently. What's the best recommended line length and bar length for the 10m to make it loop well and playful?
i notice kite attitude do a 60cm handle with a large centre hole. What are your thoughts on those? May buy one and swap the gubbings over off my ozone.



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"Flysurfer Soul 10m" started by drsurf